## helpme123456 3 years ago 1)People who download music eat pizza 2)You download music. 3)You eat pizza. is this invalid,law of syllogism, or law of detachment?

1. julianassange

I say invalid, it's not true. That is opinionated.

2. helpme123456

Thats what i thought

3. qpHalcy0n

This is invalid. It is the fallacy of the undistributed middle. "I am a person, but I am not all people"

4. sabimaru

I think it's a perfect example of the law of detachment. says if given a->b (in this case, download music -> eat pizza) someone downloads music means they are "a" so they are also by definition "b"

5. helpme123456

I think its invalid. Its optional.

6. sabimaru

But you're not given any other information, right? it's an if/then statement... unless I'm mistaken?!

7. qpHalcy0n

If you were to do a formal logic proof on this, it would sound more like "There exist those who when they eat pizza, they download music". To conclude the proof you would have to say "There exist at least some who when they eat pizza, download music." However, what their conclusion is saying is that "For ALL people, when they eat pizza, they download music", this is cleary false.

8. helpme123456

^

9. qpHalcy0n

See: Existential instantiation/Universal instantiation for predicate logic.

10. sabimaru

where are you getting simultaneity from though? I am no expert in logic, but I don't think the last claim is the ultimate one this is making

11. julianassange

Ooh, this seems like a civilized disagreement. *grabs popcorn

12. sabimaru

hahahaha

13. sabimaru

what's your thought on the matter, @julianassange?

14. julianassange

Yes, It is simply invalid. No more further say, because once said opinionated, you can conclude that is not true as a fact, simply true as a false thought.

15. helpme123456

This is entertaining..

16. sabimaru

I mean, I get it. I know that the set {music downloaders} is a subset of {humans} and that there is a separate subset {pizza eaters} that intersects with music downloaders.

17. qpHalcy0n

Right well ultimately there's two problems here because the events are disjoint. Eating pizza and downloading music. There's no implication. It's not implying that because I eat pizza, I download music. Second. You vs. People. You = "There exists" People = "For all" You cannot do this. You cannot say because there exists one where this is the case then it must be true for ALL.

18. sabimaru

cool

19. julianassange

Invalid is the answer for the win!