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Directrix Group Title

What is meant by the OS Code of Conduct admonishment to "guide" an asker to a solution? This is being interpreted in at least two ways. One interpretation is that the Asker must be engaged to some extent in a dialogue about the creation of a solution to the problem the Asker posts. A second interpretation is that the Answerer's reply to the Asker's posted question is sufficient to meet the "guide" criterion if the Answerer writes a solution to the asked problem and posts it without input from the Asker. So, how is "guide" to be interpreted? I will post examples for your consideration.

  • one year ago
  • one year ago

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  1. Directrix Group Title
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    Guide means posted solution with no engagement of Asker in the solution: I need help solving this equation. 6r^2+11r=10. My answers are r+and- i5/2 squared and r+and- 2/3 squared...I am wrong apparently. ------------------------------------------ On this problem you need to rearrange 6r^2+11r=10 to be 6r^2+11r-10=0 Then use the quadratic formula to solve. \[-b \pm \sqrt{b ^{2}-4ac}\div2a\] Which then gives: \[-11\pm \sqrt{11^{2}-4(6)(-10)}\div2(6)\] So r=2/3, -5/2 Plug those values back in to the original equation for r and you'll see the solution works out. ------------------------------------------ OpenStudy values the Learning process - not the ‘Give you an answer’ process •Don’t post only answers - guide the asker to a solution. http://openstudy.com/code-of-conduct -------------------------------------------- I did guide the asker to a solution!

    • one year ago
  2. Directrix Group Title
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    If you want to see the above in context, see the following link: http://openstudy.com/study#/updates/506617b1e4b08d1852122a6e

    • one year ago
  3. Directrix Group Title
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    What follows is a second interpretation of "guide" with the engagement of the student. A picture frame is shaped as a heptagon. The measure of one angle is 144 The remaining interior angles are congruent. What is the measure of each remaining interior angles in the picture frame? -------------------------------------------- How many sides does a heptagon have? -------------------------------------------- Seven if i'm corrct -------------------------------------------- You are correct. Now, we need to know the sum of the interior angles of the heptagon. Do you know the formula? It's okay if you don't; it's okay if you do. ------------------------------------------- well the only formula i'm aware of is (n-2)x 180 ---------------------------------------------- That's it. So, where n is the number of sides, the sum of all the interior angles is (7-2)*180 which is --> your turn to crank out the sum. ---------------------------------------------------- 900 ------------------------------------- here is where im lost hehe xD ------------------------------------- Great. So, we'll subtract that 144 angle from 900 and get 900- 144 = 756 degrees for the other six interior angles to share equally. That is because they are congruent and congruent angles have the same measure. -------------------------------------- Any idea of what we should do to the 756 to get the measure of each of the remaining congruent angles. Your turn now. ---------------------------------------- would i have to divide by the number of sides? ----------------------------------------- No. The number of sides gives the number of interior angles. But one of those seven interior angles had a measure of 144. We subtracted it from the total of all seven interior angles. Now, there are six angles left with a sum of 756. Remember that all six of those remaining angles have the same measure. Does that make sense? ----------------------------------------------- So, we'll divide 756 by what number? Your Turn --------------------------------------------- i got nothing , im sorry --------------------------------------------- No worries. Divide 756 by 6 and post what you get. -------------------------------------- 126 is the outcome, but why is it specifically divided by 6? ------------------------------------- oh because there are 6 remaining right? -------------------------------------- 144 + 126*6 = 900 which is the sum of the interior angles of the septagon. Yes, there are six congruent angles remaining after the 144 angle is subtracted. -------------------------------------- thank you so much ^_^ i appreciate your help a lot !!! ------------------------------------- Glad to help. I like Geometry.

    • one year ago
  4. Directrix Group Title
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    I can see how guide can be interpreted in two ways by reading the previous two posts. The questions to TPTG (the powers that be) is how are the OS Answerers to interpret "guide" as in guiding students to a solution? There seems to be no confusion regarding the "Don’t post only answers" because OpenStudy values the Learning process - not the ‘Give you an answer’ process •Don’t post only answers - guide the asker to a solution.

    • one year ago
  5. Directrix Group Title
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    Question for the Purple People and all OS administrators and members who would like to response.

    • one year ago
  6. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    i dont have a problem with jonnymiller's response

    • one year ago
  7. Directrix Group Title
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    Second Clarification Requested: If an Asker requests or implies a request for confirmation of an answer, is the Answerer expected by TPTB to provide more than a confirmaton or denial? A scenario illustrating this follows: -------------------- Use synthetic division to find P(–2) for P(x) = x4 + 9x3 - 9x + 2 . A. –2 B. 0 C. –36 D. 68 answer is C -36 --------------------------------- yup, thats correct. --------------------------------- thank you ----------------------------------- welcome ^_^

    • one year ago
  8. hartnn Group Title
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    ^^ that was my answer

    • one year ago
  9. Directrix Group Title
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    @UnkleRhaukus I tend to agree with you. However, the moderators (I assume) are the OS members who issue warnings to Answerers whose replies do not measure up to whatever is meant by guiding the student to a solution. After x number of warnings, the Answerer is bounced from the site. Also, after each warning, an e-mail copy of that warning is sent to the Answerer. However, the offending reply to the question for which the Answerer is being chastised is not cited. If the author(s) of the OS Code of Conduct would clarify what "guide" means, this would clear the confusion.

    • one year ago
  10. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    have only been issued one warning , and i still dont know which response of my mine warranted it,

    • one year ago
  11. Rohangrr Group Title
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    Is that a tutorial

    • one year ago
  12. badreferences Group Title
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    @Directrix When dealing with human issues; that is, the nature of how people learn, it would be a mistake to try to so rigorously define the foundations of what a "guide" is. The best response I can give is that when asked to "guide" an asker to the solution, do whatever you deem intuitively to be most instrumental to helping him/her learn. So, with me, it's unnecessary to explain every step. Give a hint, and I'm gold. Others might find it difficult to understand why fractions can cancel. They might need an actual, literal guide.

    • one year ago
  13. badreferences Group Title
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    Or, in other words, instead of giving a concrete guideline of what structure a guide might follow, instead consider a guide to be the most instrumental response you can give to helping an asker come to an understanding. So if it's immediately apparent that I have already answered the question myself, but have made a mistake in the process, a step by step solution would be better than hand-holding explanations. But if I don't know where to start... well, the issue is now about whether I understand the fundamental issues of the field.

    • one year ago
  14. satellite73 Group Title
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    wow what a lot of rules. my idea would be to relax and not worry math is hard enough as it is

    • one year ago
  15. Directrix Group Title
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    @badreferences Here's the sticking point. What is meant by guiding an Asker to a solution is not left for your or my discretion. Someone else (a moderator?) makes the decision to issue a warning and a compilation of such warnings has consequences. Therefore, Answerers should know what the author(s) of the OS Code of Conduct mean by "guiding to a solution." A definition would be sufficient. I

    • one year ago
  16. iheartfood Group Title
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    haha agreed with @satellite73 math is hard so u gotta relax lol :) i mean everybody has differnt ways of understanding so yeah as long as u learn it right?

    • one year ago
  17. badreferences Group Title
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    Language is vague enough that reasonable intuition must be exercised at every step. We have generally the same tolerances to stupidity that the mods do. So I think with a margin of error we can prevent most sorts of unreasonable punishments.

    • one year ago
  18. badreferences Group Title
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    That is, I can post a benign joke, and even though it isn't a guide, I won't be warned for it.

    • one year ago
  19. badreferences Group Title
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    "A boy owned a dog that was uncommonly shaggy. Many people remarked upon its considerable shagginess. When the boy learned that there are contests for shaggy dogs, he entered his dog. The dog won first prize for shagginess in both the local and the regional competitions. The boy entered the dog in ever-larger contests, until finally he entered it in the world championship for shaggy dogs. When the judges had inspected all of the competing dogs, they remarked about the boy's dog: 'He's not so shaggy.'"

    • one year ago
  20. estudier Group Title
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    Sherpa

    • one year ago
  21. badreferences Group Title
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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherpa_language Yes.|dw:1348907038762:dw|

    • one year ago
  22. Directrix Group Title
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    I viewed this OS video on the OS Facebook site. The helper owl gave what could be thought of as the "entire solution" to the asker owl without calling upon the asker owl for input. Interesting. https://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php?v=546254509750&set=vb.85705490637&type=2&theater

    • one year ago
  23. sara12345 Group Title
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    depends on the asker, if u sense the asker knows what he/she asking, give them respect and answer to the point. no point being formal or trying to give hints/clues/creative/twisted/beat-around-the-bush responses i see lot of ppl struggling to stick to code-of-conduct. you dont need to follow code-of-conduct literally

    • one year ago
  24. Directrix Group Title
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    @sara12345 Point taken. Question: In not literally following the code, if you were cited with repeated warnings and locked out of the site for a specific time, would you continue to answer questions *your way* despite the code upon your return?

    • one year ago
  25. Mikael Group Title
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    1) The mods should really think twice before warning/banning - read whether the asker was so SO, SO helpless, and SO hapless that the Answerer just had to finish by giving it all. In this case THERE IS NO OTHER WAY !!! 2) If they really want coherence then they MUST STATE EXPLICITLY TO ALL: "No complete solutions are provided here" " Please medal answerers for central piece of solutions."

    • one year ago
  26. Mikael Group Title
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    Aand a Dual- complement of the above: Is any editorial attention being paid to simply answer-gatherers ? People who ask, but who actively oppose explanations, only FULL solutions. I'm observing such behaviour frequently

    • one year ago
  27. amistre64 Group Title
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    to guide is to have an interaction with the person asking the question. If there is no interaction going on, there is no guidance being given. to start the process, you should ask question so that you can judge the innate abilities of the asker; and then encourage them to use those abilities to find a solution.

    • one year ago
  28. Mikael Group Title
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    Is any editorial attention being paid to simply answer-gatherers ? People who ask, but who actively oppose explanations, only FULL solutions. I'm observing such behaviour frequently

    • one year ago
  29. amistre64 Group Title
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    if the asker is "sooo" helpless as to be able to think for themselves; then we should not encourage them to continue to have other "do the thinking for them".

    • one year ago
  30. Mikael Group Title
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    But have u no mercy ? Even if this is sincere helpless person ?

    • one year ago
  31. amistre64 Group Title
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    those who demand only solutions and do not want to participate in the process are given warnings and if the behaviour is persistent, they are suspended for having an aire of cheating

    • one year ago
  32. amistre64 Group Title
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    this is a STUDY group after all, not a free answering service

    • one year ago
  33. hartnn Group Title
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    ^^ i agree

    • one year ago
  34. Mikael Group Title
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    I am ready to report such gatherers - where to report to?

    • one year ago
  35. amistre64 Group Title
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    there is a report abuse option with a comment section for being specific about the complaint that you have. This is sent to all moderators and administrators to review the situation and make appropriate judgement calls on

    • one year ago
  36. Mikael Group Title
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    This is not abuse - it is exploitation, but not abuse

    • one year ago
  37. amistre64 Group Title
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    when children are exploited, are they being abused?

    • one year ago
  38. amistre64 Group Title
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    i thought your grievence was with the term "abuse", do you wish to flop to some other debate?

    • one year ago
  39. Mikael Group Title
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    I estimate that about 25% of ALL questions are asked with preplanned intent to receive ONLY full, and chewed solution. Just observe - you will see it.

    • one year ago
  40. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    what the thinker thinks, the prover proves

    • one year ago
  41. amistre64 Group Title
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    ive been doing this for nigh on a year and a half; im well aware of them :)

    • one year ago
  42. Mikael Group Title
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    Any bans have been actually issued ?

    • one year ago
  43. amistre64 Group Title
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    of course ....

    • one year ago
  44. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    i would like to know the result of a report i issued about a month ago, i never heard back

    • one year ago
  45. amistre64 Group Title
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    we rely upon the users to feild abusive behaviour, but its not really their privy to know what happens afterwards.

    • one year ago
  46. iheartfood Group Title
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    there was this one person i was helping once and then the user stopped responding (they posted a science question in math by accident; new OS user) and then later messaged me saying they got suspended for an hour.... so suspension/bans do happen right? and do bans mean u will NEVER be able to use OS again? :O

    • one year ago
  47. amistre64 Group Title
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    the mods and administrators make a judgement call

    • one year ago
  48. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    well i was feeling quite insulted by a certain response and i dont know if justice prevailed

    • one year ago
  49. Mikael Group Title
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    Are you aware of wholesale intermediaries ? Ask and transfer, that is

    • one year ago
  50. amistre64 Group Title
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    moderators can suspend for a time limit; its up to the administrators that govern the site to cancel accounts and what nots

    • one year ago
  51. iheartfood Group Title
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    @UnkleRhaukus what kind of response?? (hope it wasn't from me right??!!)

    • one year ago
  52. amistre64 Group Title
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    i cant say im familiar with the wholesale concpet

    • one year ago
  53. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    some had a good question and i did a lot of work (without giving away the answer) , and then they drew a rude picture and it had a rude comment

    • one year ago
  54. Mikael Group Title
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    Y gathers questions from clients - a,b,c,d,e,f,g,h and i. Y asks here. Y gives them the answers

    • one year ago
  55. amistre64 Group Title
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    Unkle, regretable, that happens; its best if you can just brush it off in the end :)

    • one year ago
  56. amistre64 Group Title
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    the wholesale concept seems like a logistical issue that would have to be wieghed by those who own the site

    • one year ago
  57. iheartfood Group Title
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    agreed... just wondering, do u know when OS was first launched??

    • one year ago
  58. Mikael Group Title
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    I don't mind - the thing bothering me is that wholesalers are complete idiots as to the q.-s they post. So they just ask and shut.

    • one year ago
  59. iheartfood Group Title
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    i recently found out about OS earlier this year right b4 summer.... :) and it's awesome! :D

    • one year ago
  60. amistre64 Group Title
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    I think it was around for a year or so before I joined; created in the basement of Georgia MIt maybe? im terrible with history :)

    • one year ago
  61. amistre64 Group Title
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    Ive often considered the possibility of having dedicated answers; but thats just a pipe dream

    • one year ago
  62. Mikael Group Title
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    What do you mean @amistre64 could you just explain that dream ?

    • one year ago
  63. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    yes, do

    • one year ago
  64. amistre64 Group Title
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    Since there is no method in place to weed out good answers from the bad; that perhaps there could be a means of testing the users and see what they abilities are. The report abuses could be considered as demerits and they would not be able to reply to certain questions; while others who have shown responsible would be allowed to participate. But I do not think that is a viable plan for the nature of this site

    • one year ago
  65. iheartfood Group Title
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    hahah it's all good :) when'd u join @amistre64 ?

    • one year ago
  66. amistre64 Group Title
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    it was about a week after the tsunami hit in japan

    • one year ago
  67. iheartfood Group Title
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    ohhhh cool!

    • one year ago
  68. amistre64 Group Title
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    back then "fan count" was the determining factor of a score

    • one year ago
  69. Mikael Group Title
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    Thanks , see you around harder questions. bye

    • one year ago
  70. iheartfood Group Title
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    ohhhh really? haha :) i have no idea about smartscores lol :/

    • one year ago
  71. amistre64 Group Title
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    when i broke the fan count system; they implemented a medaling system; when satellite and i broke that; they winded their way to this smart score system ;)

    • one year ago
  72. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    ha ha

    • one year ago
  73. UnkleRhaukus Group Title
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    whats next ? a logarithmic cardinal system?

    • one year ago
  74. iheartfood Group Title
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    oh wow haha :) satellite has a smartscore of 100!! is satellite the only one with 100?? that is just amazing :O

    • one year ago
  75. amistre64 Group Title
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    dunno, maybe something to do with migratory spiritual essenses that are encaptured on brine sticks .... lol

    • one year ago
  76. amistre64 Group Title
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    satellite is the only 100er yes

    • one year ago
  77. iheartfood Group Title
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    and how do u even get to 99!?!??! that's just amazing! :O

    • one year ago
  78. amistre64 Group Title
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    my 99 status was just grandfathered in a believe

    • one year ago
  79. iheartfood Group Title
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    and wow that's so cool! I wish i had 100! lol :/ or 99! hahah eh oh well :P

    • one year ago
  80. iheartfood Group Title
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    oh hahaa cool :)

    • one year ago
  81. sasogeek Group Title
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    Directrix, here's my input on this, just got a chance to respond to your message. my internet hasn't allowed me to load OS for hours lol At the end of the day, what do we want to accomplish? if I know OS well, what we stand for is understanding, not answers, no matter the form in which it comes. Understanding is a destination and an end, but what is the means to that end? I believe that's what OS calls "guiding" an asker to an answer. The asker is the one needing the understanding, and if there's no input from them, how do you tell whether they understand or not? No matter how well an explanation of a solution to a question is, if you don't engage the asker to find out whether they get it, for all you know, your well worked out step by step solution is gibberish to them. I can say the same about the answer @jonnymiller gave in your example. Often times i see people ask a question and just when they close that question, they ask a similar question... it doesn't make any sense. to guide someone means bringing them along, you don't go all the way using the very correct routes and leave the person where you began, that's cos 90. some people want answers, some people need help. find out which one of these two types of people you're engaging first, then you know what course of action to take. remember, you're dealing with people and they're future indirectly, you either want to be a positive impact, or a negative impact.

    • one year ago
  82. sasogeek Group Title
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    sorry if i've repeated some things already said in the thread, i haven't read the whole thing cos it seems rather long but just wanted to respond to your message @Directrix :)

    • one year ago
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